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 Post subject: 80/20 Grind??
PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 6:37 pm 

Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 8:37 pm
Posts: 66
Location: Arroyo Grande, California
Im Looking at putting my next order together and im interesting in a boning/whatever blade and im looking at the Artifex Honesuki. I noticed that it had a 80/20 edge grind. What in the world does that mean and how does it affect the way it is to be sharpened??

~~~Gabe~~~


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 Post subject: Re: 80/20 Grind??
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 1:31 am 
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Location: Madison Wisconsin
This knife is ground to benefit right handed users. Most of the edge is sharpened on the right side to make it perform better. So to sharpen it you just sharpen primarily on the right side and go almost flat against the back side. You can use a sharpie to mark the edge and copy the grind the first time you do it.



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 Post subject: Re: 80/20 Grind??
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:03 am 

Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 8:37 pm
Posts: 66
Location: Arroyo Grande, California
Sounds good, Mark. =) Super stoked for my next order! I got the Honesuki and the Nakiri. I want to try them all!


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 Post subject: Re: 80/20 Grind??
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:56 am 

Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 8:37 pm
Posts: 66
Location: Arroyo Grande, California
Knife Sharpening for Newbies #15. Winning! Any Other tips though would be greatly appreciated =)


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 Post subject: Re: 80/20 Grind??
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 4:28 pm 
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This is such a complicated topic that I have a hard time putting this into words.

I've attached a picture showing (as I recall making it) a 30/70 knife.

asymmetricalgrind.jpg [6.16 KiB]
Not downloaded yet


If you put the same bevel on both sides of the knife, you move the centerline of the knife and this can affect cutting performance.

The image below is very blown up and should be pretty darn correct for a 15 degree angle.

WrongAsymetricalSharpening.jpg [4.16 KiB]
Not downloaded yet


If you correctly sharpen these type knives, the bevels will not be the same size on both sides of the edge if you sharpen both sides as the same angle

Again, very blown up....we're dealing with thousandths of an inch here.

CorrectAsymetricalSharpening.jpg [7.35 KiB]
Not downloaded yet


You can sharpen these different ways. You can sharpen the back side at a shallower angle and end up with bevels the same size on both sides of the knife. Or you can sharpen the back side at the same angle, but remove less material on that side and your bevels will not be even.

The key is to keep the factory centerline of the knife. If you don't, it can (not necessarily will) affect cutting performance. The more asymetrically ground the knife is and the more off of centerline you make the edge the more it will affect performance. Also, you won't notice it a lot of times based on what you're cutting. With a honesuki I think you'll see it less than with other knives. I find I can feel it most when I use a very asymetrically ground gyuto that I've messed up the center line on when I'm cutting hard, large veggies. So, not very often. :lol:

I hope that helps somewhat. And I hope I didn't screw up that explanation.



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 Post subject: Re: 80/20 Grind??
PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 7:05 pm 

Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 8:37 pm
Posts: 66
Location: Arroyo Grande, California
I can see how this can be a tricky concept to discuss and teach. I keep trying to find some reading material on this subject but there just isnt much out there on the net that i can find. I keep hoping for a video that can break down this subject down piece by piece. Most videos simply gloss over and give a general idea which will work for now. Looks like a sharpie, patience and "careful observation" as Murray says, is going to be the best tools for the coming task =)

~~gabe


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 Post subject: Re: 80/20 Grind??
PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:12 am 
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Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2012 4:45 am
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Adam, the diagrams are pretty good and the explanation is good.

" You can sharpen the back side at a shallower angle and end up with bevels the same size on both sides of the knife. "

Now just to clarify this if you sharpen the back side at a shallower angle the size of that bevel will STILL be dependent on HOW MUCH you sharpen at that more acute angle - from none to a lot. At a more acute angle the bevel will grow faster than with a coarse angle.

Rather than get lost in minute detail, let me just emphasize Adam's main point that you want to ' keep the factory centerline of the knife'. How you get there is secondary.


This topic is overlapping another concurrent thread :
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=1302

that has a video in it that explains this in more detail.




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Ken



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