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 Post subject: Masakage Yuki questions
PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 2:17 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2012 7:18 pm
Posts: 7221
Location: Madison Wisconsin
Hello, Mark, Susan!

I'm choosing a knife set for my mother and a good knife for myself.

The only experience with Japanese knives i had is with global knives, but i would like something more traditional for my parents' classic kitchen.

First of all do you ship to Dubai, UAE? That is where i currently live.

If so please guide me through your knives.

My current choice is Masakage Yuki - 120 petty, Honesuki, 210 Gyuto and maybe Bunka.

1. Do you think this would be a good choice? Any other knives I should consider? BTW they should be sharp out of the box and better if they would come from one series.

2. As far as i understand the knives are used as follows - petty as a paring knife, Honesuki - boning + chicken, Bunka - more of a vegetable knife, Gyuto - to me it looks like a general slicer, however Japanese do not have bread knives. Would a Gyuto knife be any good for different types of bread?

3. How does Masakage Yuki series company to Global knives and Miyabi knives?

Thank you in advance for your reply!

Regards, Michael



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 Post subject: Re: Masakage Yuki questions
PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 2:22 pm 
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1. Yes I always recommend their knives. I think they're excellent. I especially like the combination of steels used in the Yuki line. White #2 is a pleasure to sharpen and the stainless cladding is beautiful on that line of knives.

2. Sure many people use a sharp gyuto for slicing bread.

3. The Yukis are hand made by a small blacksmith shop in Takefu. Globals and Miyabis are mass produced. I would say the Yuki is far superior to Globals. I like them better than the Miyabis too.



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 Post subject: Re: Masakage Yuki questions
PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 3:20 pm 

Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2014 2:47 pm
Posts: 34
Thank you for your reply, Mark.

My mother would actually be more concerned about looks and finish of knives rather then performance - i think she would appreciate it eventually, i just do not want her to be disappointed of first impression.

Its just that i've read that finish on some tradition knives may be far from perfect.

Also - i was quite impressed with the Takamura Migaki knives performance.

1. Which of the two has a better finish and performance? Yuki has a carbon edge, which may be more challenging maintenance wise, but on the other hand Migaki does not have Honesuki and Bunka knives in its range and she would definatly require some knife for chickena and meet.

2. Please also share your views on how Yuki and Koishi compare. I understand that Koishi has better steel but how would that affect edge retention and sharpness percentage wise. Is it like 50% better or only 10%? Also regarding the coating - would not it reduce knife's slicing ability?

3. Finally, a lot of people praise Takeda knives as being one of the best all over. Do you think I should stretch my budget and buy Takeda, or Yuki would be just fine? The worst thing is buying something and then realizing that there are way better products for just a bit of extra money.

I know that is a lot of questions, but i've just discovered your site few days ago and you have such a great selection!


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 Post subject: Re: Masakage Yuki questions
PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 5:55 pm 

Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2014 2:47 pm
Posts: 34
chefknivestogo wrote:1. Yes I always recommend their knives. I think they're excellent. I especially like the combination of steels used in the Yuki line. White #2 is a pleasure to sharpen and the stainless cladding is beautiful on that line of knives.

2. Sure many people use a sharp gyuto for slicing bread.

3. The Yukis are hand made by a small blacksmith shop in Takefu. Globals and Miyabis are mass produced. I would say the Yuki is far superior to Globals. I like them better than the Miyabis too.


Thank you for your reply, Mark.

My mother would actually be more concerned about looks and finish of knives rather then performance - i think she would appreciate it eventually, i just do not want her to be disappointed of first impression.

Its just that i've read that finish on some tradition knives may be far from perfect.

Also - i was quite impressed with the Takamura Migaki knives performance.

1. Which of the two has a better finish and performance? Yuki has a carbon edge, which may be more challenging maintenance wise, but on the other hand Migaki does not have Honesuki and Bunka knives in its range and she would definatly require some knife for chickena and meet.

2. Please also share your views on how Yuki and Koishi compare. I understand that Koishi has better steel but how would that affect edge retention and sharpness percentage wise. Is it like 50% better or only 10%? Also regarding the coating - would not it reduce knife's slicing ability?

3. Finally, a lot of people praise Takeda knives as being one of the best all over. Do you think I should stretch my budget and buy Takeda, or Yuki would be just fine? The worst thing is buying something and then realizing that there are way better products for just a bit of extra money.

I know that is a lot of questions, but i've just discovered your site few days ago and you have such a great selection!


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 Post subject: Re: Masakage Yuki questions
PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 6:59 pm 

Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:20 am
Posts: 90
Mikhail

Have you also looked at the shimo line for masakage? One of my favorites and very sharp ootb. I can't comment on the Yuki or the koishi though except that they are clad with stainless steel whereas the shimo's exterior is very reactive.


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 Post subject: Re: Masakage Yuki questions
PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 7:22 pm 

Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2014 2:47 pm
Posts: 34
stevonyc34 wrote:Mikhail

Have you also looked at the shimo line for masakage? One of my favorites and very sharp ootb. I can't comment on the Yuki or the koishi though except that they are clad with stainless steel whereas the shimo's exterior is very reactive.


Finally, a lot of people praise Takeda knives as being one of the best all over. Do you think I should stretch my budget and buy Takeda, or Yuki would be just fine? The worst thing is buying something and then realizing that there are way better products for just a bit of extra money.


Actually Shimo was my first choice. But i wanted something less reactive. I may try full carbon knife for myself, but as a present to a person who never used good knives before i think that Yuki would be a better choice. Koishi is sad to be top of the line, but does it really worth the extra money?

I was actually into folding knives some time before and it was quite streigth forward - you choose size, shape, steel and price range.

I would usually go for a 3.5 to 4 inches, drop-point, powder steel up to 200$.

There are people who would spent thousands on custom knives, though performance was often questionable.

Production m390 steel would probably outperform any custom d2 in edge retention, though d2 would be probably stronger.


As to kitchen knives - this is totally new to me and steel they use is deferent and blade shapes are different....


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 Post subject: Re: Masakage Yuki questions
PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 7:56 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:00 pm
Posts: 2010
Mikhail - a few thoughts on your selections:

For most people, a 120 petty does not make a good knife for in-hand paring tasks. It's more of a short utility knife. If you're thinking of true in-hand paring, I'd strongly suggest looking for a 3.5" (90mm) paring knife. A favorite on this site is the Shun Classic 3.5" paring knife. It's very nice both aesthetically and for it's performance.

I think the Yuki series are beautifully made knives with very good fit & finish - all Masakages are also very sharp OOTB.

I'd recommend the Yuki 210 Gyuto and either the Bunka or the 150 Petty for a smaller knife.

A Honesuki is a knife developed specifically for processing poultry - it's not meant to touch bone, but to go through joints and along the carcass for removing the breasts and such. Honestly, the Yuki 150 Petty would also work well for this task and it's also a decent general purpose utility knife, a multi-tasker.

The Takamura Migaki R-2 knives are excellent performers with great OOTB edges. They don't have the hand made look of the Yuki knives, but they're very nice, all stainless blades.

The Koishi line is very nice, but I like the Yuki better for the price. They are also thinner and a little lighter than the Koishi line.


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 Post subject: Re: Masakage Yuki questions
PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 8:33 pm 

Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2014 2:47 pm
Posts: 34
Thank you Steve!

This is actually a very interesting thought. After i bought a set of globals i found myself using g-48 (santoku) most of the time. The only thing im missing with it is a sharp pointy tip.

Its just that i wanted all knives from one set.

However if i would go with Yuki 150 Petty then, 240 Gyuto would make more sense.

Than will have most of chopping and cutting covered.

Now what about paring and peeling?

I thought about:

http://www.chefknivestogo.com/kogatanaas.html

http://www.chefknivestogo.com/kokowh2.html

These would probably fit with Yuki style.

And also what would you then recommend for poultry and meet? Something with stiffer more rugged blade less prone to chipping?

It was my understanding that Honesuki would be up for the task. And by that i mean cutting bird and meet. No chopping bones or something like that just occasional unintentional bone contacts...

Maybe you can recoomend something more appropriate?


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 Post subject: Re: Masakage Yuki questions
PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 11:44 pm 

Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:40 pm
Posts: 242
I would stay away from the kogatana;s if I were you. if you are patient mark does have some 90mm pettys coming from the yuki line, just not sure when they will be here, prob at least 2 weeks though...
and for the chicken a 150 petty is more than capable of taking care of that, just no bones... and this doesent mean the knife will mysteriously decintigrate if you touch it to bone.. only that you aren't to go hacking at it like a mad man! if you rub up against a bone or two not a big deal... a honesuki is just a little more nimble at the task as its tip is designed to work well at getting in to those tight little spaces...


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