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 Post subject: My gyuto needs some love I think.
PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2014 8:00 pm 

Joined: Fri Jan 17, 2014 6:02 am
Posts: 276
Can't afford a replacement for a paycheck or two, so I'll need to give this guy some love for the time being. its become very unsatisfactory at work lately. I really had no clue what I was doing for a few years when I was learning to sharpen. With only the internet to teach me and no hands on guidance I overground it every time I took it to the stones (nearly daily) and have only been able to achieve a solid edge by maintaining it on the 1.2k bester I had and 1k ss that I had before that. Not sure if i'm rounding it off or leaving a bur or what once I get to higher grit stones, but it sure is frustrating. Here are a couple pictures of my Masamoto VG that I took yesterday.

Next to my coworkers new 210:
Image

a little blury, quick phone shot while during cleanup, but gives a good idea of the profile and how short is now. Measured it at 1 5/8" at the heel so roughly 41mm tall? its shorter than my 210 nenox now.


Choil shot:
Image
Image

Not the best shots ever, but the only two that even workd out that good out of a couple dozen shots :)


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 Post subject: Re: My gyuto needs some love I think.
PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 12:13 am 

Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2014 9:56 pm
Posts: 48
Almost looks like a fat burr leaning to the right on the bulb shot.

I am far from a sharpening expert, but it really looks like it needs more than a bit of thinning. As well, the bevel on the right looks only flat. I have a Masamoto VG as well, probably a bit more than a year old. I think mine was 70/30 when it came. I would consider putting some bevel back on the right side.


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 Post subject: Re: My gyuto needs some love I think.
PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 2:39 am 
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Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:00 pm
Posts: 2331
Nbles - based on the photos, I don't see the edge bevel coming to much of a thin point. I looks like you've thinned the right side (side facing right when cutting with the knife) quite a bit given the big chisel-like bevel behind the edge, but it doesn't look like you've thinned the other side (left) of the blade at all. It also looks like (as far as I can tell) the actual edge bevel is very obtuse and quite thick at the edge. This will happen, given how much you've sharpened the knife and moved the cutting edge towards the spine. It almost reminds me of a right-hand single-bevel Funayuki look :-), but much thicker at the edge.

I'd thin a bit on the left side as well at a low, low angle to try and restore some thinness to the edge area. Honestly, it needs a full on spine to edge thinning on a belt sander by a pro to really restore any kind of performance geometry to the blade. You're kind of on your way to a petty profile. Tim Johnson (TAZ575) could probably convert to a nice 210 Petty, if you so desire, after you get your next Gyuto.

IMO, if you'll be getting a new Gyuto fairly soon, think about the Petty conversion and don't get crazy with spending a ton of time thinning. Just thin the left side a bit, get the thinned area on both sides pretty close to the edge of the edge, then put a new edge bevel on the knife. See if that gets you through for the time being.

Just my .02

TAZ, Adam and other people experienced at grinding blades should be able to give you their preferred treatment for this blade.


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 Post subject: Re: My gyuto needs some love I think.
PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 4:55 am 

Joined: Fri Jan 17, 2014 6:02 am
Posts: 276
The actual edge is FUBAR. I tried using my sous chef's steel to at least get the edge servicable after my morning job on weds. But I'm horrible and hate using steels because of the fact that it all relies on such a small point of pressure for such a precise task. I suck at using them and try to avoid them at all costs. But...even when its fresh off the stones it feels like theres a burr *even after using every trick ive seen around to remove a burr* THEN stropping ever so lightly on the stone. If I move beyond the 1.2k Its just ruined usually.

I never knew about thinning as I sharpened until a couple months ago when I found this forum. I always associated thinning as a task required with such knives as the Aritsugu A-series that KCMA was so fond of. thats the only reason it has the bevel it has. I didn't have a diamond plate at the time so my course stone wasn't course enough and had no way of being flattened other than the only (small) stone fixer korin used to sell. Its almost a great service suji if it gets thinned severely...but thats going to cost money to get done properly, also.

The other side looks flat because it is nearly flat. in fact, if i take it to a polising stone it looks like the back side of a traditional single bevel knife other than the cutting bevel (which I have thinned, but isn't very noticable) I can try to grab a photo of that also.

Guess I might have to suffer through using my nenox G(hetto)-series for a while. Have to thin that too now its looking like - I did buy it a half decade ago. unless anybody here is near Minneapolis and can mentor me in sharpening (I do have all the stones required once my new medium arrives)


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 Post subject: Re: My gyuto needs some love I think.
PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 6:57 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 8:11 pm
Posts: 304
Location: NE
It just needs thinned as Steve said. I would recommend thinning on the face side of the blade. Start thinning above the bevel where it is thickest. I would only thin the backside as you have already described, just enough to meet the apex. There is a lot of metal needed to be removed. I would second suggesting having it professionally thinned and balanced. It would give new life to this Masamoto. Have it ground thin - have the handle sanded some to re-balance the knife and have maximum performance from it once again. Personally, I wouldn't want to shorten the height at all. It will eventually reach petty height in another 5 years :) and you can thin it again.


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 Post subject: Re: My gyuto needs some love I think.
PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 12:45 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:13 pm
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Yeah, definitely needs a lot of thinning or a regrind!!!! Profile almost looks like a KS with the shorter, flattish blade profile. It needs a whole new grind, a belt sander would work best for it!


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 Post subject: Re: My gyuto needs some love I think.
PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 12:51 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 07, 2013 12:44 am
Posts: 842
DAT PUPPY WANTS SOME THINNIN OUT!!!!

That should help fix your issues. I agree with the "don't shorten it anymore" suggestion. There is no reason that after a thin and reprofile that it shouldn't last you another couple years.



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 Post subject: Re: My gyuto needs some love I think.
PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 1:53 pm 

Joined: Fri Jan 17, 2014 6:02 am
Posts: 276
I love the profile I've developed on it!! :)

Who are the pros who take care of such things?


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 Post subject: Re: My gyuto needs some love I think.
PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 2:05 pm 
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Nbles, I was thinking the profile on it is pretty bitchin'. Kind of a Funayuki/Gyuto style.

Send it to TAZ575 (Tim Johnson) - you'll be glad you did :-).


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 Post subject: Re: My gyuto needs some love I think.
PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 6:39 pm 
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Yeah, I'll agree with the others that it needs some serious thinning. That should make it cut well again.



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