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Re: shun 6 inch chef knife

Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:45 pm

organik wrote:this thing looks awesome have you used it personally?

My brother has one. He was showing it off to me and I chopped a little celery and garlic with it and loved the feel. It's a cool looking knife. I don't have a lot of experience with many J-knives yet, so you know, but that knife is on my wish list know.

Re: shun 6 inch chef knife

Fri Apr 12, 2013 2:08 am

ORGANIK <> If you're looking in the 150mm range & you rock cut, seriously look into a petty with some height. I'd say the Tanaka Sekiso, but it's reactive. This Kanehiro in san mai ginsanko is an AWESOME FRIGGIN KNIFE! http://www.chefknivestogo.com/kagipe15.html The most appropriate sized Wa relative to overall knife dimensions I've ever used. I own one, and use it daily.

{FYI: I'm a professional Chef, and I use her everyday in concert w/a 95mm parer & a 270mm Gyuto (sometimes 240).}

Re: shun 6 inch chef knife

Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:07 am

If you want a 6" chef's knife, you should buy a 6" chef's knife. But the reason you give is based on a very common misunderstanding.

With few exceptions a short knife won't do any of the chopping tasks (plank, stick, dice) on small vegetables any better than a medium length knife (240mm - 270mm). When it comes to chopping, the advantage to shorter knives is that they are easier to "point" intuitively, and get the knife aligned with the product so you can make the parallel cuts which are necessary for producing the classic shapes and sizes. However, you can point a medium length knife just as easily if you have a good grip -- including a straight wrist -- and not only get much better production and longer edge retention, but a more natural action from the knife as well.

Furthermore, very short chef's knives are almost all belly. That makes it difficult to get much of a flat section on the board, which leads to incomplete "accordion" cuts; makes it hard to get the point down to the board (scoring shallots for instance); and makes for a lot of handle pumping.

That you can't do light chopping work with a 150mm without mashing your knuckles on the board also indicates problems with your grip. If your already using a pinch to chop (and I presume you are), you need to "come over the top" more.

There are two things really good about a pinch. The first is keeping your knuckles on the side of the handle, and not on the bottom, so they never hit the board. The second, is that a pinch grip makes pointing a longer knife intuitive. If you're not getting the benefits of both things, there's something wrong. In any case, you might try reading Getting a Grip on a Good Pinch as food for thought if nothing else.

As it happens, I have a 7" Sabatier "Nogent" chef's knife which I bought to break down smallish fish, and like a lot. Because it's a fun knife, I invent other reasons to use it; but I don't kid myself that it's as good a knife for any chopping task -- including small veg -- than any of my (four, 245mm to 270mm) "go-to gyuto." If I were still cooking professionally, I'd use it even less.

If your intention in purchasing a new knife is to get something you'll use more than for occasional, "specialist" work: Think twice, and twice again about a 6" gyuto.

There are a lot of really good gyuto and petty knives running around. The places to start narrowing down the selection is by considering your budget, and what you're willing to do to keep your new knives sharp.

The more you know about knives the better you'll understand why: Friends don't let friends buy Shun.


Re: shun 6 inch chef knife

Fri Apr 12, 2013 1:46 pm

Wow! Thanks for all of that info I have a lot to think about now it may be a few weeks until I buy a new knife maybe months but I really want to read and learn as much as I can. It seems like buying a really nice knife for working in a kitchen could be a bad idea because it might get thrashed or used by the wrong person. Is that true? And what is the thing that's so bad about shuns? The quality isn't very good?

Re: shun 6 inch chef knife

Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:25 pm

For me, Shun isn't a "bad" knife but you can do MUCH better for the same or less money.

Shun ---> Overpriced department store J-Knife

Re: shun 6 inch chef knife

Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:58 pm

IMO, Shun wouldn't be so bad for the price if the profiles were better. You have to admit, the fit and finish on them is very nice. The grind on the Classics is actually fairly thin behind the edge, although a rather bulky feeling knife for the size, it's the profile that kills them. The big sweep eliminates any chance of having good board contact for chopping or working large ingredients. Sweep on a blade increases performance for 2 things IMO: Skinning and Cutting meat (and rocking, yes, I know)... both things you do on an animal and not a vegetable. So, that being said, if Shun had a flatter profile I'd probably recommend them a little more. The Blue series looks a little better, I think they're catching on to us maybe? ;)

Re: shun 6 inch chef knife

Mon Apr 15, 2013 12:07 am

i first was thinking of shun because i can get 20 percent off. now after reading all this stuff and researching a little bit i think i want to get a masakage. why would i want a 270mm over a 210mm? i chop a lot of small things at home but big things at work

Re: shun 6 inch chef knife

Mon Apr 15, 2013 12:08 am

i'm also looking at petty knives for a small knife

Re: shun 6 inch chef knife

Mon Apr 15, 2013 7:55 am

If you work in a pro kitchen, or plan to, you will definitely want the 270, no doubt about it. You will do way more cooking at work than at home, plus you get to take your time at home and use whatever you like. The knife is light enough that getting a 210 might leave you wanting more as soon as you get comfortable with it.

A 270 Masakake Yuki is a seriously good knife, it will eat Shuns for breakfast. :mrgreen:

Re: shun 6 inch chef knife

Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:29 am

organik wrote: "why would i want a 270mm over a 210mm?"

A 270 cuts more efficiently & accurately then a 210. You have a longer blade face to align things off of. Looking down at a 210 that is 3 degrees off on the product looks much less exaggerated then on a 270. And obviously you can just cut so much more at one time w/a 270. If you work in food service, do yourself a favor and acclimate to a 270 early in your career. You'll thank yourself later...
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