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 Post subject: Re: How to set a primary and secondary bevel using EP?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2014 1:12 pm 

Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 1:28 pm
Posts: 512
As always great advice by Steve here and others too of course.
Since the knives are quite old, I wouldn't worry about trying to catch up to that factory edge, just start fresh and you're on the right track.
As Steve said, commence with the more acute angle of 15 deg. Your not sharpening the knife here as you know but creating a Relief Angle, or simply a Relief. You can go use all of your stones here, i..e to the highest grit without regard to leaving teeth as that applies to the primary edge, you can make it pretty in other words.
Then you can raise the pivot arm/angle to 18 or even 20 deg for those knives. This stage should go quickly, you could start with a higher grit stone, not the 500 and see how it goes, not sure what you have in between the 500 and 4k but if all you have are those two, try using the 4k stone first and really focus here and take your time. Have patience when creating the Relief, it will pay off, your knives will be sharp and it will happen quickly.
As Steve said, you can then apply a micro bevel by raising the angle yet again to 23 or 25 deg.

The beauty of the Relief Angle is that you only have to do that once, for touch ups you can go directly to the primary edge. I think of the Relief Angle as a little ramp for the food to slide up on as you cut, it is nice and polished and enhances the process of slicing food.

Have fun.


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 Post subject: Re: How to set a primary and secondary bevel using EP?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 3:03 pm 

Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2014 11:21 am
Posts: 169
Location: Long Island, NY
I'd like to thank everyone for their advice. It's all been very helpful and it's starting to make some sense to me now.

Took my first crack at the EP yesterday with a training knife (Kitchenaid Santuku I don't really care about). Made my first mistakes :mrgreen: but it's all starting to make sense. Completely understand why the angle cube and flattening plate are going to be a necessity for what I'll need to do down the road.

Hard for me to see the Henckels going back the factory edge in my lifetime unless I set them up as everyday knives for relatives or something. Grinding them to 15* is what got me started on this obsession in the first place.

At present I have the Shapton 500, 1000 and 4000. These are 29.4, 14.7 and 3.68 µ stones If I'm reading the comparison charts right. That would make the Shaptons about 300, 750 and 3200 relative to Chosera.

New plan is to start fresh and get a 15* angle on the Kitchenaid using all 3 stones with focus and time spent on using the Shapton 1000.

Question: When I do the microbevel should I use the Shapton 500? It's a pretty course stone. Not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing when I'm setting the microbevel.

Thanks again for all the suggestions. Once I get this down on the Kitchenaid I'll be ready to progress to the Henckels, then maybe my Shun paring and utility and If I get cocky my Kikuichi. Ultimately I'm thinking I'd like to end up with a good carbon Gyuto but that's down the road.....



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 Post subject: Re: How to set a primary and secondary bevel using EP?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 3:20 pm 

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:22 am
Posts: 733
Get your 15 deg relief bevel to 4K. Then apply the edge bevel at 18 or 20 deg. You can try to use the 4K because there isn't a lot of steel to remove at this point.


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 Post subject: Re: How to set a primary and secondary bevel using EP?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 11:42 pm 

Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2012 5:21 am
Posts: 77
I live in Suffolk county on the North Shore. I have a fair number of stones and both Edgepro models. If you get stuck with anything, I'd be happy to help out. Got some things from Mark you might like to try.


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 Post subject: Re: How to set a primary and secondary bevel using EP?
PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 3:34 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:00 pm
Posts: 2391
Sounds good Rob. If you're cutting a new bevel on the Santoku, I would actually focus and spend time on the 500. Get as perfect of a bevel as you can, and get it as sharp as you can w/the 500 first. This is the most critical stone. After than, you'll simply be refining that edge with the 1K and then the 4K (if you wish). The work w/1K and 4K should not take long at all if you get a nice, sharp bevel w/the 500. That's the easiest, fastest way to do it IMO.

As Rick said, if you want to do a micro bevel, just raise the EP stone arm a little, the use your 4K to create a VERY small bevel on top of the 15* bevel. I'd actually try it with the 15* bevel first and see how it performs - a micro bevel might not be necessary.


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 Post subject: Re: How to set a primary and secondary bevel using EP?
PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 4:11 pm 

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:22 am
Posts: 733
SteveG wrote: I'd actually try it with the 15* bevel first and see how it performs - a micro bevel might not be necessary.


I agree at least try it at 15. If it folds like cheese you can then put the 18 on top if it.


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