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 Post subject: Re: The Grand Unified Grit Chart
PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 5:16 am 

Joined: Wed May 02, 2012 11:14 am
Posts: 187
Location: Florida, USA, Earth
How were the grit and micron ratings derived for the Spyderco stones? As far as I know Spyderco doesn't use grit or micron ratings at all. But using the grit and micron ratings on the grit chart and putting the Spyderco stones in rotation with the DMT and Shapton glass stones I have they work great when using them in the order where they appear on the chart. I dont' have a Spyderco med. stone but after I use a DMT EF stone I use the Spyderco fine then UF then the Shapton glass 8k. Using every stone is not needed but using them in that order works great. I can use a Shapton glass 4k instead of the Spyderco stones.

I was just wondering if the ratings were determined based on scratch pattern appearance or if Spyderco provided any info.


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 Post subject: Re: The Grand Unified Grit Chart
PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2014 1:23 pm 
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Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2014 6:19 am
Posts: 307
BigMike wrote:I notice what seems to be an error in the EP Stock Column. 1000 is listed as coarser than 2000. Are those just swapped, or is there a reason for that?

Thanks,
Mike



I'm also curious about this, and here is a crossover chart that is on the edge pro website. The crossover seems different than the chart posted here. Either way the chart posted here is great and very useful.

Image


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 Post subject: Re: The Grand Unified Grit Chart
PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2014 1:42 pm 

Joined: Wed May 02, 2012 11:14 am
Posts: 187
Location: Florida, USA, Earth
Hutch wrote:
BigMike wrote:I notice what seems to be an error in the EP Stock Column. 1000 is listed as coarser than 2000. Are those just swapped, or is there a reason for that?

Thanks,
Mike



I'm also curious about this, and here is a crossover chart that is on the edge pro website. The crossover seems different than the chart posted here. Either way the chart posted here is great and very useful.

Image


On the UGC I think the 1000 and 2000 grits in the EP column must just be a typeo. But, I think if you swapped them they would be pretty accurate judging by scratch patterns they leave based on my experience (which is small). Do all Shapton (?) stones of the same grit leave the same scratch pattern? All I have used is the Shapton glass. The chart on the EP site compare the EP 1000 to a Shapton 8000. I used to use the EP 1000 a lot and don't remember it ever leaving the bevel even close to the finish possible with a Shapton glass 8k. Does anyone think the EP 1000 stone can leave a bevel finish that can be called "mirror" or "almost mirror"? IMO the 8k Shapton glass leaves a mirror finish to the naked eye. Naked eye is my favorite view. Magnified edges and bevels just depress me after looking at what is a pretty edge to my naked eye. :) Going by the naked eye I think I get a mental picture of the toothiness of an edge by going by the scratch pattern on the bevel. THe scratch pattern on the bevel from a 500 grit tells me the edge will be toothy. The scratch pattern left on the bevel by an 8k stone tells me the edge is smooth. Without high magnification this is how I estimate the coarsness or smoothness of the edge apex. Does this sound like a decent way to judge edge smoothness by the naked eye?

Jack

Jack


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 Post subject: Re: The Grand Unified Grit Chart
PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2014 9:31 pm 
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Joined: Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:17 am
Posts: 3718
That crossover chart is a joke. Chocera 800 = Shapton 2000, give me a break.



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 Post subject: Re: The Grand Unified Grit Chart
PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2014 12:45 am 

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:22 am
Posts: 654
Ben Dale claims on his website that the 2K tape is 9u and the 3K tape is 3u. So I have no idea how he can rationalize the claim that 2K tape is equivalent to a 20K Shapton which would be submicron if it existed.

A number of people from the knife community collaborated to make that chart. Yes, it looks odd, but it is accurate given the data available.

Cheers,

Rick


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 Post subject: Re: The Grand Unified Grit Chart
PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2014 1:14 am 

Joined: Wed May 02, 2012 11:14 am
Posts: 187
Location: Florida, USA, Earth
Tall Dark and Swarfy wrote:A number of people from the knife community collaborated to make that chart. Yes, it looks odd, but it is accurate given the data available.

Cheers,

Rick


I don't know about exact grits and micron ratings but with a Shapton glass 320, DMT-fine, DMT-extra fine, Spyderco fine, Spyderco UF, Shapton glass 4k and 8k I progressed through these stones in that order. This is the same order as they appear on the UGC. With each finer grit stone the scratch pattern got a little smoother. The Spyderco stones are the only ones that don't have grit and micron ratings from the company and where they fall on the chart I think is accurate. My experience is far less than the guys who put the chart together I'm sure. If one of the Spyderco stones had a grit estimated that was wrong putting them between DMT and Shapton glass stones with known ratings the scratch patterns would have shown that. An example would be after the DMT-E the Spyderco fine might have left a coarser scratch pattern. So from the little experience I have and the very few type stones I"ve used the chart seems accurate to me. I now have a Shapton glass 1k giving me the 320, 1k, 4k and 8k. The Spyderco fine grit should fill the gap that the 2k would if the chart if right. I'll try using the 1k, Spyderco fine, 4k some day and watch the scratch pattern. I still wish I had the Shapton glass 2k and will pretty soon I suppose. The 4 Shapton stones I have work great for a progression. It seems the 2k is a great stone grit that seems to seperate coarse edges and smoother edges. Just my feeling. As I said my experience is not all that high. Also, the fact that the stone types are different add other factors in addition to grit I think. I'm talking too much. :) I should have said "I think the chart is accurate". :)

Jack


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 Post subject: Re: The Grand Unified Grit Chart
PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2014 1:38 am 

Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 1:24 pm
Posts: 65
i have the whole line of shapton stones and (okay not the 6k or 32K) and my stock stones

there is NO WAY the 1K EP is even close to 8K MAYBE the 2K tops. I would put it in the middle of the SG 1K and 2K

I would rate the tapes EP-2K = 2K... EP-3K = 4K ......EP-6K = 4K+ diamond spray but you get a much better finish and edge from the SG stones than the tapes and you can get scratches out.



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 Post subject: Re: The Grand Unified Grit Chart
PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2014 4:11 pm 

Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2014 12:42 am
Posts: 21
What jmbullman said. Thanks Ken. Very interesting to this newbie...


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 Post subject: Re: The Grand Unified Grit Chart
PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:58 pm 
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Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2014 6:19 am
Posts: 307
Tall Dark and Swarfy wrote:Ben Dale claims on his website that the 2K tape is 9u and the 3K tape is 3u. So I have no idea how he can rationalize the claim that 2K tape is equivalent to a 20K Shapton which would be submicron if it existed.

A number of people from the knife community collaborated to make that chart. Yes, it looks odd, but it is accurate given the data available.

Cheers,

Rick


I have used several of the 3K EP tapes, and I would say they are on par with a 5-8k shapton. Definitely not the 25K that's listed on the edge pro chart.


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 Post subject: Re: The Grand Unified Grit Chart
PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 4:15 am 

Joined: Sat Feb 22, 2014 10:53 am
Posts: 95
Location: Bangkok
Thank you so much for this chart. Its really a good guide.


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