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 Post subject: Planning to use Edge Pro for first time – Question
PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 8:15 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2013 8:05 pm
Posts: 152
Planning to use Edge Pro for first time – Questions before I start this weekend

Hi all

Thank you for the help in advanced.

I read a ton on the forum and watched several videos. These questions are specific to my situation.

My knives are basically all crap right now some of you will say they were crap when I got them. Over the years I have used on these specific knives Chef Choice electric sharpener, hand held pull systems, Spyderco sharpmaker, and free hand (I was terrible). Plus I should never be allowed to use the honing steel because I only make the knife worse, I basically messed up my own knives and sometimes my wife uses the granite counter top as a cutting board.

My question are

1. What angle should I sharpen these?
2. Can all my knives be sharpened at the same angle? (all the same brand just different styles)
3. I assume I have to start from scratch because they are so bad. Meaning start at the roughest stone I have and make a new edge/angle (don’t know if I used right terminology here). Am I right?
4. Can I use the stock stones that came with EP or do I need to buy anything before I start? EP was a gift (bought direct from manufacturer, sorry Mark). If possible, I want to use it a few months before I go buying Shapton Glass stones, the angle cube, and stop collar which many seem to love. I will get them from you Mark.

The knives – All Wusthof classics
Santoku 7 inch (I have two of these)
Chai Dao 6.25 inch
Chef 8 inch and 5.5 inch
Steak knives 4.5 (I have 6 of them)
Carving 8 inch
Fillet 6.25 inch
Paring 3.5 and 2.5
Utility 5 inch

Once I am good and addicted I will buy better knives, so no jokes please.

Edge Pro
Plus stock stones
120
220
400
600
1000
And the rod that came with it plus water bottle.

Thanks again everyone.

El


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 Post subject: Re: Planning to use Edge Pro for first time – Question
PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 12:07 am 
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Joined: Mon May 27, 2013 6:39 pm
Posts: 258
Well if they are that messed up then you will definately need to start on the 120 stock. I wouldnt get anything more aggresive till you get some experience.

No definate way to say exactly what angle you should sharpen at. Just try and match it up to whatever existing bevel or remaining bevel may be there. Over time when you see and learn how your edges handle your use you will be able to move the angle up or down to suit your purposes.

If there is no bevel at all just set it about 20ish per side and see how that stands up. Little steep for kitchen knives but based on how you and your wife have treated these knives in the past i feel that this a good starting place. (your headed down the right path now though) Just tell the wife to stay away from the granite.

I would master the factory stones before you upgrade. Not to say i wouldnt upgrade down the road. But burn up some factory rock so your not learning on expensive stones.



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 Post subject: Re: Planning to use Edge Pro for first time – Question
PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 12:32 am 

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:22 am
Posts: 813
I've been in your shoes. Lots of work ahead of you but a rewarding result. I would sharpen at whatever angle is needed to transform the jacked up portion of the edge, so no signs of previous sharpening fails are visible. The edges could use thinning anyway. No need to get a perfect edge, but close. Then follow up with an 18 degree final edge.

If you're gonna get an Angle Cube anyway there's no time like now. And an Atoma 140 will be your best friend.

Cheers,

Rick


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 Post subject: Re: Planning to use Edge Pro for first time – Question
PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 2:06 am 
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Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:00 pm
Posts: 2478
EL - I would use the sharpie trick to mark the existing bevel if there is one and try to match your angle to that existing bevel - at least to start. This is probably the fastest way to get to a nice re-ground bevel on your coarsest stone (if the knives are bad to start). When matching a bevel, use a dry higher grit stone with just a couple light strokes on the main part of the blade (not the 1/3 towards the tip) and see where you've worn the sharpie. Make adjustments and repeat as needed until you're pretty close to matching the bevel. This will be your setting for THIS knife only. If the edge bevel is at a different angle on the other side of the knife from your marked starter side, don't worry about it. Just sharpen that side until you get a good bevel like the 1st side on which you started.

Switch to your coarsest stone and set your bevel until the knife is sharp. Then move to the higher grit stones, polishing the bevel marks left by the previous stone, pulling a burr, deburring and refining the bevel with each successive stone.

If your really need to grind a lot to get a clean bevel, then I like to switch sides a few times when working towards a new bevel, to kind of meet in the middle, if you will, versus just grinding the heck out of one side before switching. You'll find it easier to get a good burr over the entire knife this way - at least I do.

I put blue painters tape on each knife face from the spine to about 2/3 to 3/4 the way down to the edge. This keeps the sides from getting scratched up on the EP from the swarf and stone residue.

The Santokus might be the easiest ones to start with on the EP.

One other important concept. If your stones are different thicknesses, then as you change stones, your angle to the edge will change as well, making it harder to get a really clean, sharp edge. Check the stones next to each other on a flat surface and see if they're close in thickness. If so, you can probably ignore this to start, but your coarse stones will wear faster than your fine stones. It sounds like you'll be grinding a lot with your coarse stones on these dull knives.

The drill stop collar is worth it's weight in gold because you can set it using a high grit stone once you've found your bevel angle and then switch to any of your EP stones, making a precise, corrective adjustment in height to keep your angle constant. It's easy and you'll experience better results.

The angle cube is really nice for repeatability, but you can do well with just a stop collar and sharpie.

Good luck and have fun!


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 Post subject: Re: Planning to use Edge Pro for first time – Question
PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 10:21 am 

Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2013 8:05 pm
Posts: 152
Thanks for input

Change of plans

I am only going to sharpen one knife this weekend, one of my Santoku. Going to tape up my knife as suggested and do the sharpie trick. Plus keep notes. Use my stock stones starting at 120 grit.

I just bought the Atoma 140, 60x mini magnifier, angle cube, and drill stop collar. I suspect I will have those for next weekend.

Then next weekend do another knife but this time use angle cube, stop collar plus magnifier to see what I am doing (That assumes I know what to look for!). Will try to refrain from using Atoma 140 for at least my first 2 knives.

El


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 Post subject: Re: Planning to use Edge Pro for first time – Question
PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 10:49 am 

Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 1:28 pm
Posts: 532
I think it is a good idea to start with one knife, build your confidence and you have everything you need to do get the job done.
Yes you could sharpen every knife at the same angle, but the advice from SteveG is awesome, it hits all the right points.

(The atoma 140 is truly a magical piece of gear, I can't imagine not owning one now)

Here is another point, it's just my perspective:
Don't feel the need to go out and purchase other stones for the EP right away.
With the stones you have right now, you have what you need to make those knives sharper than new. (I have a million EP stones now but I still use those stock stones quite often). Become completely confident and efficient with what you have now and that will take some time, be patient. Then down the road at some point after you have defeated those knives you have and any other challenges, reward yourself with a couple of "key grit" stones. Start at the bottom of the stone chain, work your way up in grit from coarse to ridiculously fine, it's those coarse and medium stones that you will come to appreciate most, my 15, 000 grit shapton pro stone for the EP now is used mostly just to show my friends and neighbours how cool I am because I have a 15,000 grit water stone :)

All the best of luck to you.
Peter


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 Post subject: Re: Planning to use Edge Pro for first time – Question
PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:53 am 

Joined: Tue Aug 27, 2013 2:10 pm
Posts: 181
emaduro wrote:
...

Then next weekend do another knife but this time use angle cube, stop collar plus magnifier to see what I am doing (That assumes I know what to look for!).

...

El


covers what to look for.


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