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 Post subject: Re: Gyuto recomendation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 1:22 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2012 5:24 am
Posts: 294
If it were me. Konosuke


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 Post subject: Re: Gyuto recomendation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 1:51 am 
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Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 10:53 pm
Posts: 335
Location: Seattle, WA USA
Jreb04 wrote:so it seems there is a divergence on the hiromoto.


Not really. It's a great knife, period. B_D_L presents his opinion as if it's fact, but it's just one guy's opinion. <shrug> He's a smart guy and has good stuff to say but one needs a grain of salt with much of it. ;) Pretty much like everything else on the internet aye?


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 Post subject: Re: Gyuto recomendation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 2:08 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 5:46 pm
Posts: 217
Adam Marr wrote:I'm sure you know this, but you state that the Kikuichi TKC is a wa-gyuto.....which it's not. It's a western handled gyuto.

Thanks Adam,

I wrote yo when I meant wa and vice versa. When I realized my error, for whatever reason, I couldn't edit the necessary changes.

BDL


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 Post subject: Re: Gyuto recomendation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 2:25 am 
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Joined: Wed May 16, 2012 4:42 pm
Posts: 3613
Location: USA... mostly.
BDL <> If you go to USER CP, then BOARD PREFERENCES, then choose BRITISH ENGLISH... your edit button will appear on the top right of your posts. Furthermore, there is a cutoff whereas after an hour or two, no edits are allowed...



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 Post subject: Re: Gyuto recomendation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 2:50 am 
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B_D_L presents his opinion as if it's fact, but it's just one guy's opinion. <shrug>

Of course my opinion is an opinion, I didn't think it needed a disclaimer but if it does:
My opinion of the Hiromoto did not come to me from letters written on a wall by a flaming finger. It is a product of my experience.

That experience consists in part of several years on the line (a long, long time ago), including working as boucher (which meant among other things that I sharpened every frikkin' knife in the kitchen); a couple of years of my own catering company; and teaching cooking and knife skills for charity. While I certainly don't know all there is to know about knives and using them, there's enough there to count for something. Take it for what it's worth. The same with my opinion.

My first Japanese knives were Hiromoto AS, two gyuto and a suji, so I do know a fair bit about their performance. I bought them with an eye towards replacing my carbon Sabatiers as everyday go to knives. But after a few months with the Hiros, I realized the Sabs were better in my hands and on my board than the Hiromotos despite the Sabs' need for nearly constant steeling -- partly for the reasons I gave, partly because the Sabs suit my particular action so very well, and partly because (as I learned from the Hiros) san-mai knives feel "muted" to me on the board.

My wife, who does not have the same level of technical knife skills (for instance, no pinch grip) but who is a very good cook in her own right, preferred the Sabs as well for their more comfortable handles and better feel on the board.

Anyway -- and still in my experience based opinion -- making a good recommendation is usually not a question of finding the "better" knife, but more about matching a knife to a person. That's why I try to give some context and explanation instead of stating a bald opinion.

It's a great knife, period.
Now I'm confused. Is that opinion or fact?

  • Is the Hiromoto AS really so good that it's fair to call it a great knife without any qualification?
  • Is it really great in every respect?
  • Is it better in some ways more than others?
  • What about the AS makes it a great knife?
  • Do you believe there are better knives than the AS?
  • Which ones?
  • In what ways are they better? And,
  • If other knives are better, is the AS still great?

BDL


Last edited by boar_d_laze on Fri Apr 05, 2013 3:30 am, edited 4 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Gyuto recomendation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 3:08 am 
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BDL <> Image

...did I mention how much I enjoyed your writing.?! :P



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 Post subject: Re: Gyuto recomendation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 3:22 am 
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Melampus wrote:BDL <> Image

...did I mention how much I enjoyed your writing.?! :P


Thanks!

Also, thanks for the advice on how to make the edit function work. Unfortunately, changing my preference to British didn't allow for editing posts which were written as American.

BDL


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 Post subject: Re: Gyuto recomendation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 3:29 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Gyuto recomendation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 3:43 am 
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Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:13 pm
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Location: CT
BDL has a good amount of experience; I remember his stuff from other forums when I first started out!

Hiromoto's are decent knives, but not the end all of knives. They are priced low enough for people in the $150-$200 range. Based on the 2 Santokus that my mom and aunt have (from several years ago), I find the handle F&F to be a bit rough, sharp edges between the metal and handle material, possibly due to the movement of the material or just being too quick making/shaping the handle. The blades are OK, but can be a bit thick for some people. My mom has a AS Santoku and the handle (and whole knife) seems oddly heavy with the metal bolster, more so than other bolstered western handled knives. One of these days I will rehandle and thin it for her. It cuts decently, but the profile may not suit everyones tastes and needs. Whoever said that the Hiromoto is a very Western style of Japanese knife hit the nail on the head with that comparison! It makes a great bridge between European style knives and Japanese style knives, but many people end up modifying the Hiro or getting other knives.

I used to go for the Western handled knives constantly and somewhere in the last few months, I feel myself prefering Wa handles or bolsterless Westerns now! Unless the bolster is a hollow bolster, the knife just feels too heavy and clunky to me unless the handle is large enough to balance out the bolster, but some handles are just too wide, too, especially as they get longer.

I would really look at a Wa handled knife, like one of the Lasers (AEB-L or AS), a Kono HD if it's in your budget or something like that; they just feel so much better in the hand to me than the Westerns do now.


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 Post subject: Re: Gyuto recomendation
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 4:06 am 

Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 1:30 am
Posts: 8
I don't know that I wouldn't like a wa, but I have never used one. I rock chop mostly because I have a shitty knife. It wouldn't push cut if I wanted to. That's why I am upgrading. I just want to slice through my vegetables like butter. I do pinch grip more and more, but my knife still sucks, so I think that I am gonna go with the Kono HD wa. About to click the button.


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