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 Post subject: Carbon steel knife for cutting bones.
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 2:02 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2012 7:18 pm
Posts: 7232
Location: Madison Wisconsin
Hi Mark,

I am looking for a carbon knife that doesnt get chipped when cutting bones or at least doesnt get chipped to chicken bone, is there anything you could recommend? Or advise on what sort of steel for example, blue steel, white steel etc. I have a series of Moritaka Aogami Super Steel knives. I thought ASS is the toughest carbon steel in the range, but I was wrong and I chipped my wagyu-to by cutting a frozen ginger. So what would you recommend?


Sincerely,
SteveT



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 Post subject: Re: Carbon steel knife for cutting bones.
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 2:10 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2012 7:18 pm
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Location: Madison Wisconsin
Hi Steve,

Carbon steel comes in many different types and they are heat treated to varying hardness. Hardness and toughness are inversely related so a carbon steel knife made from Aogami super steel with high HRC hardness is a knife that will take an acute edge and hold it very well but it is more prone to chipping as you discovered with your Moritaka.

What you need is a knife with a less acute angle on the edge and that has a much lower HRC hardness. There are carbon steel knives that will do this job as well as stainless. Many German knives meet this criteria. I keep a large Wusthof Chef knife around for times when I want to cut through something hard that might damage my Japanese knives. We also sell something called the CCK bone chopper that is a beastly, thick, soft carbon steel cleaver that is meant for destroying chicken carcasses.

Let me know if you have any other questions and if you need help with your chipped Moritaka.



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 Post subject: Re: Carbon steel knife for cutting bones.
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 4:26 pm 

Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2013 11:01 pm
Posts: 165
Hi. At work we use a cleaver like the one below for chopping pork, chicken, etc. It is probably 6 or 7mm thick. What would be the best way to sharpen it...would the edge pro work on it or would the EP stones wear down. What angle would you suggest for the cutting edge? Thanks much.

http://www.centralrestaurant.com/-in-Cl ... p2236.html


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 Post subject: Re: Carbon steel knife for cutting bones.
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 5:01 pm 
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Posts: 2726
Yeah, get a bone cleaver:

http://www.chefknivestogo.com/cckbonechopper.html

Carbon, and definitely capable of going through chicken bones without damage.

There are other CCK options as well.

If you take a Misono Swedish gyuto and put a really obtuse edge on it, you could probably get through chicken bones without damage.

Other wise look for a carbon steel western deba. I know that Masamoto and Suisin both make a carbon steel western deba (or Yo-deba)



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 Post subject: Re: Carbon steel knife for cutting bones.
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 10:11 pm 

Joined: Wed May 16, 2012 1:49 am
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Location: Amstelveen, The Netherlands
On my Misono Swedish I put a 2 3/4" flat section from the heel, à la française, strictly symmetric, inclusive angel some 40 degree, for all dirty tasks. It allows me to keep other sections very acute and asymmetric. The tip gets a microbevel.
Once you get used to it, it considerably improves both overall edge retention and performance.


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 Post subject: Re: Carbon steel knife for cutting bones.
PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 11:23 pm 

Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 12:35 am
Posts: 9
You can search the web for knives made from L6 steel. It is supposed to be the toughest of all steels, it's a carbon steel.


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 Post subject: Re: Carbon steel knife for cutting bones.
PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 9:40 am 
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Something without a very fine or single beveled edge. Western deba...as the japanese like to call it.

I like the nice Henckel 4 star II series. I have one of the yellow handled (commercial kitchen use) twin henckels
that i bought for $20 from a guy i knew who was a chef....he got them through work. Awesome knife...takes a great edge and holds it for a surprisingly long time.



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 Post subject: Re: Carbon steel knife for cutting bones.
PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 1:46 am 

Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2012 11:52 pm
Posts: 18
I second the L6 ... Tougher than chicken bones..

When I pheasant hunted for real and had to dress at least 30/day of the wild ones, I used a cleaver to take care of all the gross cuts. Filet knife for the others.

I had a house in North Dakota at the time and it had hot water in the garage when I bought it for clean up. The first time we washed all the residue we couldn't collect down the driveway into the sewer, the 80some year old lady across the street said " that's how most guys do it". I knew we were in the right town.

We offered her some pheasants and she was like "Oh, I don't eat those ditch chickens".. OK then..

We used to clean thse birds in nitrile gloves, just because, and I took the ends off a few glove thumbs with that cleaver so be prudent...


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 Post subject: Re: Carbon steel knife for cutting bones.
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 3:00 am 
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"We offered her some pheasants and she was like "Oh, I don't eat those ditch chickens".

lol...



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 Post subject: Re: Carbon steel knife for cutting bones.
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 1:15 am 

Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2012 11:52 pm
Posts: 18
It was a pretty visceral deal..

We took those completely wild pheasants off 8000 acres of mostly wheat with some sunflowers, rape (canola), and signicant CRP acreage. They were mighty tasty although the legs were for the stewpot only. Those were some high speed ditch chickens.

Not to completely derail and sorry Mark, but I lost my L6 knife guy. I could use a source for those to supplement my collection.


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