It is currently Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:30 pm



Welcome
Welcome to chefknivestogo

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. In addition, registered members also see less advertisements. Registration is fast, simple, and absolutely free, so please, join our community today!





 Page 1 of 4 [ 39 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Gyuto Advice/Recommendation?
PostPosted: Sat Jun 14, 2014 7:44 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:01 pm
Posts: 148
Hey Everyone!

I have made some big changes to what I'm looking for in a knife since my last thread and (with Steve's help) have come up with some final choices. I was wondering what everyone here thought about these and which might best suit my interests/desires in a knife.

Brief Bio
-LEFT HANDED
-Pinch grip
-Home cook, cook every day
-90% veggie, fruit, boneless meat and breads, sometimes (once a month maybe) squash or harder stuff like that.
-Looking for 210 or 240 (240 is preferred but can deal with 210 if its the better/right knife)
-Carbon edge is ok but prefer not full carbon, edge patina is fine but prefer not to have the whole knife that way
-brand new to sharpening but have King 1k/6k combo stone and base to learn
-$200ish budget, some flex to that,cheaper would be nice but im willing to invest in a real good knife

Knives:
Wusthoff classic 8in chef
Felt heavy, dull and clumsy, like a blunt force instrument more than a scalpel. Big belly which i found odd, i tend to do more if a straight up and down chop along with slice and push cut.

Victorinox 8in chef
Lighter and more nimble than Wush but flexy blade that i didnt like, bit more belly than i wanted as well, handle was decent but nothing to be thrilled with

Tojiro DP 240mm
Heavy, feels unnatural in my hand, lacks agility, some wedging in sweet potatos, some food sticking. Feels more like a blunt tool again vs. a scalpel. Like the profile more than Wush, stiff blade is a nice point. Handle feels very large and heavy as does the knife overall.

Global G2 Chefs 8in
Lighter, more agile, sharper feel. Still not as sharp as i would like but better. Closer to feeling like a scalpel or an extension of my hand vs a tool. Favorite so far but i know there are better out there...

Also, I'm fine with the knife not being overly heavy, to me, I want the knife to feel like it's simply an extension of my hand so to speak. Basically, if they made actual Star Wars light-sabers (yes I know this isn't really possible) I would 100% use that as a knife vs. say a claymore or a battle axe....

The LIST
-Konosuke HH Stainless Wa Gyuto 240mm $238
http://www.chefknivestogo.com/ko24wa.html
-Konosuke HD2 Gyuto Ho 240mm $268
http://www.chefknivestogo.com/kohdwa24.html
(what is the advantage of the HD2 over the HH? Is it really worth the $30 price premium?)
-Takamura Migaki $175
http://www.chefknivestogo.com/takamura.html
-Kikuichi Performance TKC 240mm Gyuto $219
http://www.chefknivestogo.com/ic24gy.html
(I'm fine with waiting on this one if it's the best or most appropriate choice)


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Gyuto Advice/Recommendation?
PostPosted: Sat Jun 14, 2014 10:01 pm 

Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2012 11:01 pm
Posts: 471
Location: ATL
It's hard to go wrong with that list. Disclaimer I've used none of the four knives listed, other than a short stint with the Takamura petty I purchased for my father as an early father's day gift. I would feel informed enough to choose between the four "for me".

Kono v Kono: Is the 911 4S worth the extra coin over the straight 911? It's an individual choice, but I would think the near universal view is the HD2 is the superior knife. How do you feel about plain jane Ho wood handles or would you rather save $30 and get a prettier handle? It's a serious question.

Takamura: I really like this line of knives. Also thin, very shiny and pretty knife with a great western handle on it. I don't recall if the grind was biased since you are a lefty. Not available in 240.

Kikuichi: I know the least about this one as it's never grabbed my attention. Universally praised from those that own/use it and looks like a regular old western knife to me. Out of stock as you noted.

If it was me I would get the HD2 in 240 even with the Ho handle (and I hate those handles). You know it will be a winner. How many people have purchased one and said "ehh, it was ok. I didn't really care for it?". I don't recall one and you did mention light saber.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Gyuto Advice/Recommendation?
PostPosted: Sat Jun 14, 2014 11:05 pm 
Forum Moderator

Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:00 pm
Posts: 2472
I've been discussing all this with the OP. I just want to chime in that I think the Ho handle on the Kono HD is perfect for the knife. It creates a perfect balance point and with some sealing or mineral oil, it's a great handle. No fluff, no pretense, it just works unobtrusively. It's also the right size for the knife IMO.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Gyuto Advice/Recommendation?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 12:17 am 

Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 6:20 am
Posts: 2070
Only handled the Kono myself. Fantastic knife, the HD or HH would be fine though I understand that people with experience with both prefer the HD steel.

My only reservation about the Kono is it is thin and light and per you post it sounds like you might prefer a bit more substantial knife.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Gyuto Advice/Recommendation?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 12:50 am 

Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:01 pm
Posts: 148
Well after a bit more reading, I think that if I'm going to go with the Kono I should just go all in and get the HD2 over the HH. So now I think it really comes down to the TKC, Kono HD2 and Takamura.

Regarding the wood handle on the Kono HD2, is there any real maintenance that needs to be done to it aside from keeping it clean? Do I need to apply some mineral oil sometimes to keep it from cracking or becoming damaged? Is there any other stuff that must be done to them?

I know that the handles on the TKC and Takamura are the typical bomb-proof Western style in that sense that they have ZERO maintenance to them.

If anything, I would actually lean more towards the light and nimble vs. the more substantial. Part of what I'm not a huge fan of regarding the Tojiro and the Wust I have tried is that they just seemed heavy, big, bulky and clumsy compared to the Global G2


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Gyuto Advice/Recommendation?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 1:23 am 

Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 6:20 am
Posts: 2070
My oldest wa handled knife is about 3 years old now, I have not gone out of my way to maintain them and I cannot say I can see any degradation to the handle. Based on a recommendation here on the forums I do wipe my wa's down with a mineral oil soaked rag I keep around for my cutting board, but I only do that occasionally. Now I do try to keep the handles clean and dry during use but that is a combination of preserving the handles and having a strong aversion to having wet hands when handling cutlery.

There was a thread a few months back where this issue came up, several users who have many more years under their belt than I said they have not wore a handle out yet.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Gyuto Advice/Recommendation?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 5:06 am 

Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2014 7:15 am
Posts: 1341
Location: Raleigh, NC
The TKC will be beefier, a little more utilitarian. That's its draw and a large part of why I'd like one, but might make it the wrong knife for you. The Takamura is a fine knife, maybe the best of the bunch for some, but will be much more difficult for sharpening purposes whereas the other three will sharpen easily. The HD2 will definitely patina over the entire blade, which you've said you do not want, so the HH may be your best bet. I have two knives from the HH line and I like them very much.

That said, I understand a search for the perfect knife, but from your descriptions, you may need to reevaluate your expectations. I've used Wusthof and Victorinox chef knives each in 8" and 10" extensively, a Tojiro DP lightly, and a Global a few times. Though the Wusthof is the closest, I wouldn't call any of them a battle axe. In fact for about 8 months I and an 8" Wusthof were inseparable. I used the knife literally four or more hours a day, six days a week. There's no doubt I had the extension of my hand thing down pat; in fact I don't have another knife now that I feel quite as comfortable with. My sous has one and I used it tonight, and it sang even better because my knife skills have improved. All of these are precision instruments, particularly when properly thinned and sharpened. What you'd be getting with a Konosuke is a massive refinement on that, but if you think it's going to be the difference between a shovel and Excalibur, you're going to be disappointed. This isn't upgrading from a Pinto to a Boxster, it's upgrading from a Mustang to a Boxster.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Gyuto Advice/Recommendation?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 7:16 am 

Joined: Wed Mar 05, 2014 2:28 am
Posts: 283
I love that you are shedding love towards the wusthof. I have an ikon and I love it; however, after trying superior steel, I've upgraded it before and I'll upgrade it again. Its still not leaving my roll... sorry for the tangent and back to the op. Each knife you have listed is a fantastic, well respected choice. From what i have read about the hh vs hd, hh as a fully stainless will out perform most stainless steels, whereas the hd will out perform most carbon without full reactivity. There is no cult following behind the hh, and the hd is viewed as the be all end all laser. The tkc, on the other hand, some say its not a laser or its not a work horse, while others say it is a laser and it is a work horse. It has a reputation for the perfect blend of functionality and durability while using a comparable steel to the voodoo cult hd. I'll stop being long winded and let others chime in, hope this helped


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Gyuto Advice/Recommendation?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 12:14 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:01 pm
Posts: 148
My oldest wa handled knife is about 3 years old now, I have not gone out of my way to maintain them and I cannot say I can see any degradation to the handle. Based on a recommendation here on the forums I do wipe my wa's down with a mineral oil soaked rag I keep around for my cutting board, but I only do that occasionally. Now I do try to keep the handles clean and dry during use but that is a combination of preserving the handles and having a strong aversion to having wet hands when handling cutlery.


Happy to hear this about the wood handles, that was my only real concern or thought negative about them. I have no problem trying out a new handle type I just didn't want it to be something I had to think about/do more maintenance on.

That said, I understand a search for the perfect knife, but from your descriptions, you may need to reevaluate your expectations. I've used Wusthof and Victorinox chef knives each in 8" and 10" extensively, a Tojiro DP lightly, and a Global a few times. Though the Wusthof is the closest, I wouldn't call any of them a battle axe. In fact for about 8 months I and an 8" Wusthof were inseparable. I used the knife literally four or more hours a day, six days a week. There's no doubt I had the extension of my hand thing down pat; in fact I don't have another knife now that I feel quite as comfortable with. My sous has one and I used it tonight, and it sang even better because my knife skills have improved. All of these are precision instruments, particularly when properly thinned and sharpened. What you'd be getting with a Konosuke is a massive refinement on that, but if you think it's going to be the difference between a shovel and Excalibur, you're going to be disappointed. This isn't upgrading from a Pinto to a Boxster, it's upgrading from a Mustang to a Boxster.


I do definitely understand that I'm not going from a butter knife to a light saber. I get that the improvement will be more incremental, obviously a noticeable one but still incremental. (we can debate all day on how incremental but it's not like I've been cutting with a spoon...) Regarding my comparisons and descriptions, I specifically choose language that was a bit more extreme or color-full in order to help convey my feels or impressions. The differences between all the knives I tested were noticeable yes but not momentous, all of them cut food well but by using fairly descriptive and strong wording I was hoping to get across the differences I felt and my impressions of them.

I personally haven't read or seen too much about the HD's reactivity so I think I'll keep that as the fore-runner in that category. I guess what I'm wondering now is if the Takamura is a laser type knife but just a "lesser" one than the HD2? I understand the TKC is a bit of a different beast altogether.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Gyuto Advice/Recommendation?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 12:20 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:01 pm
Posts: 148
Tired to quote and it didn't work correctly, my mistake :(


Offline
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 Page 1 of 4 [ 39 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: ceast, stevenkelby and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


suspicion-preferred